(time limit 30 minutes)
Minutes:
Councillor Sykes, Leader of the Liberal Democratic Group:
“I welcome Councillor Shah to this meeting. I’m sure everyone would join me in condemning what she has had to experience recently and in doing so showing those people that we are conducting the business of the town here tonight.”
My first question to the Leader tonight is on an issue that for my Liberal Democrat colleagues and I think is of paramount importance to the future of the people of our Borough, and indeed the people of our planet. I am, of course, referring to climate change and this Council’s ambitious targets to become carbon neutral in 2025 and make our Borough carbon neutral by 2030. Oldham cannot of course single-handedly save the world from climate change, but by taking practical actions to reduce our carbon footprint, and by leading by example, we can make a difference. Every little helps. So, I was pleased to see in the recently published Covid Recovery Strategy reference to the ‘green recovery’. But, unfortunately, when it comes to actions and targets the document falls short on specifics. It references our intention to ‘develop plans’ for a new District Heat Network using renewable heat from disused mines underneath the town centre; to ‘start to deliver’ improvements in energy efficiency in social housing; and to ‘develop plans’ for Council corporate assets. The mine heat project is something I personally welcome as I first suggested it to the then Leader at the October 2014 Council meeting, but sadly it must surely now be in jeopardy as the Government has failed to support the proposal as part of our Towns Fund bid? But, in any case, this misses the real point.
In Bedford, as just one example, the Council also declared a climate emergency, identified its baseline level of carbon emissions, and by installing solar panels on its Council buildings, replacing street lighting with LEDs, and establishing a hydro power scheme in the Great Ouse River, reduced its carbon emissions by 62%. 2025 is only four years away.
Would the Leader not agree that by now we as a Council should be ‘doing’ like Bedford and not just ‘planning’ and ‘starting to deliver’? So, when are we going to start ‘doing it’? Otherwise, how are we as a Council showing leadership and providing encouragement to our public, social and private sector partners and our citizens to join us by doing their bit to stop climate change and save our planet?”
Councillor Arooj Shah, Leader of the Council responded:
“Can I acknowledge Cllr Sykes initial comments regarding the last 24 hours which have been very difficult? I cannot say that this has not affected my family and the people I love, because it has, but what I am clear about, that whoever is responsible, and for whatever reason, I will not be diverted from the task in hand. Madam Mayor our town is facing some of its biggest challenges yet, and as we emerge from Covid, the fragile nature of economy and our society will be tested to the limits. My sole focus is on the town and its people. I came into public life because I demand better for every man, woman and child here and, to realise that this will require all the energy I and everyone in this chamber and more widely into the Council and our partners have in us, so let’s get on with the task in hand and with doing that I am going to defer the question to my colleague Councillor Abudl Jabbar, who has the portfolio responsibility for the area that Councillor Sykes has just raised, but I would like to thank him for standing and supporting for exactly the good of what Oldham is.”
Cllr Jabbar, Deputy Leader of the Council and Cabinet Member, Finance & Low Carbon:
Thank you to Councillor Sykes for his question and thanks to his party for constantly raising the green issue and the support in a number of things that we have tried to do. I think it is a really important question. Let me go through what we are doing. It is good that it is in the Recovery Plan because that just shows the commitment of this Labour administration and we see green as an important part of recovery for this town. In terms of some of the details you talked about, can I just say that we have to set up Oldham Community Power which is solar PV panels on a number of public owned assets and they are actually generating clean electricity for those buildings. We also installed solar power panels on the Tomyfield market. We have planned to install a new ground mounted solar farm on the Wrigley Head site but sadly as you know, the Government turned down our request for funding from the decarbonisation fund.
In terms of all the other things we are doing, we have got a very comprehensive plan, it is called the Green New Deal. We are the first Council anywhere in the land to have such a detailed comprehensive plan to deal with the climate change issue. You will say that we have not seen any projects; I can assure you we are doing a number of things. The coal mine water heating system that you talked about cost £20m. We asked the Government to give us £4m from the Towns Fund. Unfortunately, they did not. That was just to do the bore hole test and also do the feasibility. It is not off the agenda. We are looking at different funding sources. I am absolutely committed, on behalf of the administration to find a way to bring that project to reality. We are absolutely committed to that in terms of some other things we are doing.
The target that you mentioned for 2025 is for the Council buildings and for the street lighting to be carbon neutral for that date. As part of the revision of our assets, we will make sure that whatever we do next, the renewal energy stuff is taken care of and we come close to achieving carbon neutrality in our new buildings. As part of the street lighting, we are already working with the PFI provider to change the bulbs to low energy. We have done that. There are a number of things that we are doing. If you look closely Howard, we are one of the leading authorities in Greater Manchester. That is not enough, as far as I am concerned because there is a lot more to be done, but as an administration, we are doing everything we can, are totally committed, and I look forward to working with you and your group on this matter. Thank you.”
Councillor Sykes, Leader of the Liberal Democratic Group:
I thank the Leader of the Council for her comments and also the Deputy Leader. We will be constructive about this because it is too important not to be. My second question tonight, is a subject that I have previously raised in Council and that is using the spending power of the Council and its partners to do greater good for our communities by employing it to purchase goods and services from local producers, suppliers and trades people and to employ local people. Of course, this creates a VIRTUOUS circle, nobody disagrees with it, as local companies take on more local people and then these companies and people invest their earnings in the local economy as do our residents who are council employees. The result is a more vibrant local economy and higher levels of local employment. It is not rocket science, it’s rather the reverse. The meerkat TV Celebrity Professor Alexander Olaff would call it simples, but for this to work, we need to ensure that spending is placed with providers based in our District ??? as well as Oldham itself. This strategy would reflect the new reality that I spoke about with our previous Leader, in September 2020 Council meeting, suggesting that local is the new normal. People are more likely to work from home, shop from home, socialise or engage in leisure activities, in their home, around their homes or in their home’s locality. When they do venture out, it will be to local outlets. They want their Council’s and its partners to reflect that attitude, to invest first and foremost in our Borough by spending, but also investing locally with trades and businesses in Chadderton, Failsworth, Lees, Royton Shaw, Upper Mill amongst others to make these District centres vibrant alongside Oldham. Sometimes that may involve thinking outside of the box which is why I recently asked for consideration for an artisan and producers’ market to be established in Shaw.
Can the Leader therefore please tell me, how far off the current 60% target for local spend are we? What is the administration going to do to increase our local spending by stages, substantially above the current target of 60%? What plans are there to invest and spending in our District Centres as well as Oldham and what plans are there to earmark more of our Council jobs and those of our partners for local people who live in our Borough? What support are we giving to local people so that they can access these jobs at the Council, Health Bodies, Colleges and other public services. We need to lead by example as it will be us locally who builds back better, and we need to do it for ourselves. It is already clear to me that no one else is going to do it or help us do it in any meaningful way”.
Councillor Arooj Shah, Leader of the Council responded:
“We are absolutely committed to local spending in Oldham and the recovery of our economy. I am setting up working training to ensure that our procurement process focusses on social value far greater than it does at the moment. In terms of economic recovery set up, I have arranged and will be launching an Economic Review Board which will be chaired by Alan Francis, who is the Principal of Oldham College, another national and local expert who will help support in our building back agenda. Specific data will be provided to you and I am absolutely committed to economic recovery and recent partnerships between the college and the MCA employment for young people is a step board and my desiring commitment to show that I am willing to work collaboratively to get the best and go there.
The question around artisan markets, I recently met with you Councillor Sykes and we had this discussion and I am absolutely committed which is why I have got a Cabinet Member for Enterprise and Businesses which will focus on encouraging and supporting businesses and District Centres via establishing hubs but also I will look and provide and commit to the opportunity of investing in local people and that will be first and foremost in my agenda. Thank you very much.”
Councillor Graham Sheldon, Leader of the Conservative Group:
“It gives me great pleasure to congratulate you on your success to the position of Leader of the Labour Group and of this Council. It is the first formal opportunity I have had to wish you well in this significant and demanding role. The Conservative Group will support you when we agree, and put forward a fair and constructive objection, where we may disagree. I am shocked by the news we heard yesterday about your personal trauma, indeed the attack on a person or their property, must not be tolerated. The Conservative Group condemn all verbal and physical abuse to any person carrying out their work or duties. I do not know of any background information but there seems to be tension in Oldham at the moment, and I am hoping that by working with local community and Police, these tensions will be calmed and subside. The Police must be our first call to deal with the upholding of the law and I would ask Councillor Shah to agree that any suggestions of vigilante groups keeping law and order in our town, are strongly discouraged and stopped.”
Cllr Arooj Shah, Leader of the Council responded:
“I have previously answered this question as a public question, but I would like to thank and welcome Cllr Graham Sheldon’s comments, but I would also like to take this opportunity to remind everyone in the chamber, that whilst there are tensions in Oldham, the people of this chamber have the utmost responsibility to make sure that we challenge ourselves in our conduct, our colleagues in our conduct and our political groups in our conduct and that goes wider than just the membership of this chamber, Madam Mayor.
If we are truly promoting political peace, which I gave my commitment to at Annual Council, when I was declared Leader of this Council, then I would like to see that demonstrated cross party, that we call out bad behaviour, whether that’s one of our own, or if that is anybody else. Of course, I do not understand why I keep getting these continuous questions around vigilante groups and the police being first point of contact. I find it deeply offensive that there is even an assumption that this is not something that I would believe in. I have mentioned previously about my upbringing, my background, my experiences but I am here, and I know who I am, and I am here to lead the Council to make the lives better of every single resident who lives in this Council.
I welcome Cllr Graham Sheldon’s comments but I would also like to point people to using policy areas to attack each other and have discussion and debate around ,but not to make any other assumptions that are dumbfounded, and they know are not necessary or appropriate for this chamber, because every time we speak or behave in a certain way, or give room to these kind of conversations, we are actually doing a disservice to democracy for other people who are watching us and I would just like to remind everybody of our responsibilities.”
Councillor Graham Sheldon, Leader of the Conservative Group:
“I thank the Leader for answering that question and I can certainly say that we will work together with everybody if that does occur. The second question is on a brighter note, with the easing or end of lockdown next Monday, we are all aware of new expectations which could increase the Covid infections in the country, in the Borough. We are told that the vaccination could be up to 98% effective in preventing these infections. I believe it is still a race to vaccinate people, as the disease continues to spread. Long Covid is something that is being discussed more and more. There are thousands of people of all ages, but sadly it is also affecting young children. Will the Council Leader join with me in thanking the Government, Scientists, medical professionals for their works so far, and to encourage people within the Borough to take the offer of the vaccination if they are able, and at the earliest opportunity? not only to protect themselves but their family, friends and those around them. I will continue to wear a face covering in crowded spaces and hope others do the same”.
Councillor Arooj, Leader of the Council responded:
“Thank you, Councillor Graham Sheldon, for your question. Our rates are significantly high locally. We are actively monitoring them. We have vaccinated nearly 300,000 in total of first and second doses in Oldham and will continue to promote our pop-up community clinics across the town.
I would also like to thank the officers of this Council, the community and voluntary sector, who have really adapted in flexible ways to make sure that access for testing and vaccinations are available to our communities and across the town. I have deep concerns that I have raised publicly about the announcement around the 19th July. I will also continue to wear the face mask, as my colleagues will do in this chamber, and we need to continue to do what we have done all along, which is what Oldham’s response has been, putting our residents first, protecting our loved ones, families and our wider communities, and in that sense I would like to use this opportunity to thank Councillor Graham Sheldon for his question, and the scientists that have had a difficult challenge, that has sometimes played out publicly, in managing politicians, especially those that are Ministers in Government at this time, who seem to blurt out announcements for the sake of it and at times hasn’t put public health or the concerns of our residents, at the fore front, but we will continue in Oldham in the same spirits that we have, and that is taking all the precautions that are out there, staying safe and protecting our loved ones.”
Councillor Brian Hobin
I would also like to convey my thoughts to the Leader of the Council on the events of yesterday. She is well aware that she has our backing. On policy matters, the previous administration purchased Spindles Shopping Centre at what was supposed to be a bargain price. I would like to know if this administration has carried on with that plan, if they have any different plans for Spindles and if there is an update on what the bargain price is now up to with the added spending that has been taking place on the site. Thank you.
Cllr Arooj Shah, Leader of the Council responded:
“Thank you Madam Mayor and I would also like to thank Councillor Brian Hobin for reaching our and supporting me through the last 24 hours. Buying Spindles was a great decision for Oldham for several reasons. It was a bargain, even if we knocked it down, the land alone is worth more than what we paid for it. It gives the public control of a large site right in the heart of the town centre meaning we can turn it into something that works for Oldham rather than leaving it to rot in the hands of disinterested Californian investors. It is a key to unlocking several other projects because we own Spindles so we can create a new performance space, develop a great new site for the XXXX market traders and create much more cost-effective Council offices, develop new houses in the town to reduce pressure to build on the green belt and create a brand-new town centre park. Without Spindles this all becomes a lot harder. As we develop our plans for Spindles, it is vital that regardless of the opinions of some in this chamber, that residents are at the heart of our decisions. This is their town centre. We received more than 2000 responses to the consultation we ran earlier in the year. We will be consulting again in the summer to see what people think of our earlier ideas designed in response to what people have said. The purchase of Spindles was completed in October 2020 at the cost of £9.5m and this purchase included the whole site and all leases with the exception of a leasehold on the Top Man unit, which was purchased later in June 2021. There are huge opportunities here and I will be continuing with that plan because it has been endorsed not just by my predecessor Council Leader, Sean Fielding but also residents of this town and in that spirit we will continue.”
Councillor Shuttleworth
“I wish to bring to the attention of elected members a posting by an individual who stood for election at the local elections on 6th May in this Borough, and I apologise in advance for the wording and I quote:
Definition of 'Parasite', "an organism that lives in or on an organism of another species (its host) and benefits by deriving nutrients at the other's expense."
Speaking of which, did you know for the pleasure of wearing a few baubles and chains the Mayor of Oldham will trouser an extra £15,662 in allowances for just putting a faux fur coat on and parading around in chains. They will cost you £25,638 for the privilege.
The leveler in me thinks this is rotten hypocrisy of the highest order when the same Councillors complain about children going hungry. Meanwhile they gorge themselves on taxpayer funded civic meals and events whilst being paraded around like the prize pig. That doesn't include the cost of the Mayoral Chauffeur driven car by the way. What a Rotten Borough! End of quote.
May I ask the Leader to express her thoughts about this comment and also ask Cllr Shah to formally raise this with the Leader of the Conservative Group in Oldham to establish if these are the views of his group, and if not, what action he proposes to take against the individual concerned?”
Cllr Arooj Shah, Leader of the Council responded:
I thank Cllr Shuttleworth for his question. I’m sure I share the view of most people in this chamber and those watching online that this sort of attitude and language is hugely destructive. We’ve seen over the last year what an important role the Mayor of Oldham plays, raising money for charity, supporting communities and doing little things that make a big difference for people like marking birthdays and anniversaries. I would encourage the poster to look at the Mayor’s Facebook page to see all the incredible activity and hard work the role involves, and will certainly raise the issue with the Leader of the Conservative Group.
I’d like to raise a wider point though. We’re all very aware of the hate being stoked up in our communities. We’ve seen it online, locally and nationally with the shocking response to the result at the Euros. Let’s be clear: tolerating this hatred online has real world consequences.
We’ve seen a growth in the kind of dehumanising language used by Mr Quigg. By calling someone a parasite, we invite people to treat them as less than human and open to attack. Like several other members in this chamber, I’ve experienced a barrage of it in the last couple of years. You can attack my political decisions all you want, but most of the time instead I get attacks against me as a person. Sadly we’ve seen people in this chamber echoing the arguments of those who seek to divide us, even when they admit elsewhere there’s no evidence to support them. I hope they can now see the potential and real consequences of their actions. It’s not a game – people’s lives are at stake. Oldham is better than this, and it’s time for us to show it”.
Councillor Dean
“Please could the appropriate Cabinet member give me an update on the future renovation to the archway and house at the entrance to Greenacres Cemetery.
This is an historic and attractive building that has now been encased in scaffolding for over 15 years because of structural issues. I have raised the problem on a number of occasions, and been told solutions are being looked at, but no progress seems to have been arrived at. This is an iconic entrance to Oldham’s largest cemetery, and residents are asking for progress.
I would be grateful for a positive reply.”
Cllr Jabbar, Deputy Leader of the Council and Cabinet Member, Finance & Low Carbon responded:
“Thank you to Councillor Dean for his question. The Council took steps back in 2016 to address a number of structural issues that were found to this archway structure, that consisted of two attached residential properties that also have structural problems. A protective scaffold was put into place at the time, to ensure that access would be maintained to the Cemetery, whilst funding opportunities could be explored to address the necessary remedial works identified which have been estimated to be in the region of £0.5m.
While Government cuts mean an ever-decreasing funding pool for competing priorities, we are currently undertaking a strategic asset management review of the Council’s estate to see if a potential funding opportunity can be found to support the necessary renovation works.”
Councillor Alyas
“We are all aware that during the last round of budgetary considerations it was decided to reduce the amount of direct funding that Mahdlo receive from the Council and I am aware that the Council offered to support Mahdlo in accessing alternative funding streams. Can the relevant Cabinet Member please tell us what support is being provided to Mahdlo and have they been able to access alternative funding?”
Councillor Eddie Moores, Cabinet Member for Children & Young People responded:
“Thank you Cllr Alyas. I would like to assure Members that we have an ongoing dialogue with Mahdlo. Councillor Officers have met with Mahdlo on several occasions and supported them in identifying possible funding streams. I am pleased to be able to tell you that in addition to the £300k investment the Council will give to Mahdlo in this financial year the Council has also helped them to secure additional funding. This includes
- £4,714 from the local support grant
- £18,000 from the Restart Grant
- £75.000 from the Additional Restrictions Grant
- In addition, Mahdlo, following a bid, will receive a further £34K investment from our Holiday Activities Fund; this will support their activities during the Summer.
- The Council is also investigating how its social framework supports the wider voluntary sector offer including Mahdlo.
As promised, The Council supported Mahdlo in identifying funding streams and this support will continue to allow Mahdlo to make an impact on the lives of so many young people.”
Councillor Murphy
“The Government has recently consulted on new proposals to overhaul refuse collection and recycling in England. The stated aim is to recycle 65% of our waste by 2035 and reduce landfill to a maximum of 10%.
The proposals have been met with dire warnings in the media and from some councils that homes will be cursed with seven bins as a result, that bin collection is being ‘nationalised’, and that the proposals represent ‘costly chaos’.
In Oldham we are ahead of the game in already providing for free garden and food waste collections, but can the Cabinet Member please tell me what the Government’s proposals would mean for Oldham, when we are against the 65% target, and whether the 10% target for landfill might mean our Borough is threatened with more air-polluting incinerators, like the one rearing its ugly head to burn the residual non-recyclable waste?”
Councillor Abdul Jabbar, Deputy Leader and Cabinet Member, Finance & Low Carbon.
“Thank you Councillor Murphy for your important question. The waste collected within Oldham is disposed of through a shared contract with other Greater Manchester Authorities. Given the combined authority aims to achieve 55% household recycling by 2025, 60% recycling across the 20 Household Waste Recycling Centres by 2021 and at least 90% diversion from landfill by 2021 we are well placed to deal with the Governments proposals with no plans for additional facilities.”
Councillor Woodvine
“As a result of once having had more Turnpike Roads than anywhere else in the country the Civil Parish of Saddleworth, which was at that time in the West Riding of Yorkshire, has twenty-five surviving milestones which have fallen into a state of disrepair after being neglected.
They were erected in 1894 and as such are historically significant so please can the Cabinet Member responsible commit to repairing and restoring these milestones on Saddleworth’s highway network?
I have relevant reports into the current, deteriorating, condition of the milestones which I can share with the Cabinet Member which includes information and shows where they are located in Saddleworth.”
Prior to CouncillorJabbar’s response, as follows, the Mayor advised that due to timings, Cllr Woodvine’s question would be the last question to receive a response.
Cllr Jabbar, Deputy Leader of the Council, Cabinet Member for Finance & Low Carbon
“Thank you Councillor Woodvine for this question. Whilst in the full bid it would be necessary to demonstrate that this contributes to building back better, and has significant community support, it would in theory be eligible for a bid through the Local Improvement Fund if you wish to apply.”.